From: Jeff Lightner (jlightner@water.com)
Date: Mon Aug 15 2005 - 15:42:05 EDT
Hmmm - mixed results on this one.
My original questions are at the bottom.
On shutdown abort most folks concurred it should only be done as a last
resort.
Steve Sandau took that position but sent the link
http://www.database-forum.com/ftopic17162.html
which interestingly had DBAs both pro and con on shutdown abort.
Magnus Andersen pointed me to www.ora-600.com and look at the published
article named "Stayin' Alive"
This has a rather good discussion of "shutdown abort" and gave what
appears to me convincing arguments for using it so long as one does it
the way spelled out in the document. Specifically it said it cleans up
shared memory segments which was one of my reasons for posing the
question.
On the security question most folks were mystified as to what would do
this. However Magnus did offer a hint:
Without seeing their tnsnames.ora file it is hard to say. There is one
option where you in the file on the client call a second tnsnames.ora
file using something called ifile. I use this for ease of
administration. I've put it on a server that if it is down they cannot
connect anyway so I don't have the issues you are seeing, but I could
have.
On a more humorous note some Admins indicated my DBAs gave them greater
appreciation for their own. :-)
My conclusions based on the above:
1) "shutdown abort" is a religious issue (like tar vs. cpio)
rather than a real one (like kill -15 vs. kill -9) so long as it is used
properly. (Meaning we'll never all agree on which way is better.)
2) I was correct in doubting the worthiness of a security setup
that impacts the Production database when a client isn't available.
Thanks to all who responded:
Steve Sandau
Magnus Andersen
Peter van Eck
Cindy Yoho
Jim Turner
Rita Workman
Dan Zucker.
My apologies if I've left anyone out.
________________________________
From: Jeff Lightner
Sent: Monday, August 15, 2005 8:27 AM
To: 'hpux-admin@dutchworks.nl'
Subject: shutdown abort and security for Oracle
Guys,
I know this isn't an Oracle forum but thought I'd tap the Unix Admins
about these two things to see if anyone else has come up with good
arguments against what appear to me to be bad practices.
1) Oracle DBAs here are running "shutdown abort" in Oracle to stop
it instead of "shutdown immediate". Everywhere I've been before the
scripts would FIRST try the immediate and only if unsuccessful try the
abort. The DBAs here say that doing immediate somehow prevents
successful recovery.
Does this make sense to anyone? Is there any other reason a shutdown
abort would be preferable?
2) The DBAs have setup their security in such a way that it checks
for hosts in tnsnames and if not there won't work. This means if we
have Windows machines shutdown without notifying them it causes
problems. I've not worked anywhere before this that hosts not actually
running the Database impacted the Database.
Does anyone know what kind of Oracle security setup would require
clients to be online? Is there a better way that doesn't require this
but still provides security?
Jeffrey C. Lightner
Unix Systems Administrator
DS Waters of North America
678-486-3516
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