From: Omar Herrera (oherrera@prodigy.net.mx)
Date: Wed Oct 11 2006 - 19:55:40 EDT
Hi Neo,
You should really think what needs to be tested. I.e. is it the replication
capability or the infection vectors and defences against unauthorized code?
A while back I requested something similar (I was the client at that point),
and we requested a malicious code without replication capabilities that
could establish communication back to the attacker. At that point we already
knew that an attacker could possibly steal information or perform activities
with the privileges with which the malware was executed.
We tested several attack vectors, including email attachments. Replication
is very dangerous and difficult to test in a production environment (it
might even be illegal if you use real viruses/worms), and I don't see the
point of it unless you want to test specifically a solution to slow down
network/file replication. Once you get access to an internal machine there
are things with more potential impact that an attacker can do.
Also, if the only controls you want to test are black list based antivirus
software the test would be pointless in my opinion (You can code yourself a
very simple trojan horse and make sure beforehand that most AV won't detect
it). There is no way they can pass such a test unless you use old, well
known, real viruses/worms, which of course they should detect. However, I
would leave these kind of tests to the labs that have the resources to
benchmark all the Anti-X (anyway, the results are only useful for marketing
purposes of these companies).
Still, if there are white list based controls in place (e.g. host based IPS)
I would say that the test might be worth trying, because the security will
depend more on their configuration (i.e. the white lists) than on the
product.
In any case you should never try other's code unless you have the source,
have studied it and are completely sure that it will behave as you need. The
best thing is to program and test it yourself. Remember that there are many
ways to get a program into a machine other that using the network (e.g. a
free CD or usb memory stick given to an employee with a nice "gift"
included); in fact, these are likely in targeted attacks so I would suggest
you take them into account.
Contrary to what many people seem to think, you don't need real "malware" to
test this as long as you plan it carefully, your client agrees completely
and both understand perfectly the implications of such tests.
I hope this is useful.
Regards,
Omar Herrera
> -----Original Message-----
> From: listbounce@securityfocus.com [mailto:listbounce@securityfocus.com]
> On Behalf Of neo anderson
>
> Hi List,
> I wish to know your views on "Using viruses in pen-test"I
> I've been working in the infosec domain for over 2 years with a couple
> of infosec certs including CEH and conducting pen-tests for my clients
> for about a year.
>
> My recent client has hired me for carrying out "every possible" type
> of pen test.
> This includes testing organizations defence mechanism against viruses
> as well, this includes to test whether anti-virus administrators have
> up-to-date virus definitions etc. I'm supposed to gather this
> information by means of thorough penetration tests only.
>
> As we all are aware that how the viruses (worms/trojans included)
> enter into the corporate network propagate over LAN. There are many
> ways like email attachments or infected content brought in by
> employee.It spreads on itself thereafter.
>
> Now my question:
>
> Is there any standard procedure to test the posture of organizations
> network security against potential virus threats? I mean i wish to
> know about pen-test carried out against Antivirus-product. In order to
> replicate itself, a virus must be permitted to execute code and/or
> write to memory. Thus this pen-test should also tests that.
> And do I need to use some known viruses for this kind of pen-test?
>
> Have your thoughts on this topic please.
> Thanking you all.
>
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